Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community - FT86CLUB - View Single Post - Monogram Series FR-S is official!

dnieves · 01-05-2016, 10:04 PM

I'm not sure why you compiled my two separate responses to one, so I'll separate them again.

>PITA to do on a phone

On the first line, you said the sales people only know Toyota and know nothing about the Scion brand cars. My response was each dealership that sells Scions have Scion Ambassadors, including myself in my dealership, who have gone to training to embody that title. The only reason a dealership that sells Scions won't have a Scion Ambassador or has a Scion Ambassador that doesn't really know anything is because the dealership was cheap enough not to send someone to training, which is going to hurt them in the end.

>We need Scion Ambassadors at my local dealerships as the salesmen leave a lot to be desired.

The other line was you saying Scion doesn't advertise. My response was Scion does.

>I have a Motor Trend subscription (perfect demographic for a car person) -this month's ads are typical: Chevy/Acura/Lexus/Honda/Subaru/Nissan/Infiniti/Jaguar no Scion. Let me guess, print media (like television) is dead so there's no point in advertising? The last time I saw a Scion television ad (rare as unicorns) was during the Epic promotion and the FR-S uber-esque promotion.

They recently advertised heavily in ESPN for the iM and iA, and their ads are still running. Since it's football season, why not? That's a great way to capture the market's attention. Does it mean everybody who will buy a Scion is going to be a sports person? Of course not, but that's a good start introducing their newest cars to the public. And did I say they're not advertising anywhere else? Or would you rather they not advertise at all, which was what you said was one of their problems?

>They need to disperse their advertising dollars in an efficient way, targeting the demographics of consumers that are purchasing Honda Fit/Ford Fiesta/Toyota Yaris I think ESPN is short sighted (talk about putting all your eggs in one basket).

And let's face it, a lot of people barely watch TV anymore. So much easier to just watch a stream of it on the internet at our own schedule than hope our recording device is doing its job and that we set it right. Scion also advertises heavily on YouTube. Those annoying ads before we can even watch the video we clicked for.

>Are you sure the ads aren't a result of a Scion person looking for Scion related clips due to your browsing behavior?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dnieves

I think the problem is Scion customers want a choice (like Subaru did with the Limited and Premium). If you want bare bones get the base model, if you want HID/push button start/etc get a deluxe model, if you want TRD accessories and etc order (like heated seats/mirrors) them as options (makes the dealership more money and keeps customers happy). If you want the limited buy that -> a limited edition should be like what Scion did with the tC spec series and Honda did with the Si Mugen(special color/limited edition wheels) not just raiding the parts bins of extras we want that everybody like Hyundai already has. Case in point, every FR-S should have HID (maybe the special edition can have the Corolla's LED headlights). I was thisclose to purchasing a BRZ for the bells and whistles (despite loving the FR-S's front bumper skin) luckily I liked silver ignition and went for a ten series instead.

I don't necessarily disagree with your idea. I just posed an alternative to the same idea. Monospec allows people to start with a blank canvas, which is pretty much what the designer of our cars had in mind to begin with. We, the owners, get to personalize it the way we want it. The way I see it, heated seats (which my dealership can) and/or mirrors should be an option...though I think heated mirrors should be standard or an option we automatically have on the cars we get where I am. I would have also liked the push button start, dual climate control, body kit and quad exhaust to have been options, but that's where it becomes difficult for Toyota/Scion to market their special editions. Special colour and interior being the only thing making it special? I don't know...

>the special color was an example, comparable to what other manufacturers do to set their limited editions apart. My argument is Scion should follow Subaru's lead in providing consumers a choice (base or deluxe) but if it hurts their bottom line then they should make desirable parts available as accessories example: under body trays, HID, muffler tips, etc as it's unfair to make their loyal consumers have to send ridiculous amounts of money for common parts outside of North America so we can piece together a car that's commonplace everywhere else.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dnieves

Human nature.... everybody thinks they can beat the salesman.

Of course. Despite the fact that we now live in the information age and anyone could easily find the invoice price, people still think buying a vehicle is still like the in the 80s and 90s where dealerships don't disclose anything and you have to play the back and forth thing for hours when dealerships such as mine are trying their best to avoid the hassle and get more to the point.

>To be fair to those people, I've read many posts here in which some people have snagged some incredible deals on new BRZs (and a few FR-S owners that circumvented Pure Price by receiving extra $$ on their trade ins or accessories).

Quote:
Originally Posted by dnieves

Others must find their lineup less than exciting as the sales prove it. In the northeast (please jump in fellow forum members) the only Scions I ever see on the road (in NY/NJ/PA) are mostly 1st gen tCs and (1& 2nd gen) xBs, I see a lot of 2nd gen tCs (not as many as 1st gen) and the occasional FR-S. Where are the iA and iMs (not to mention the discontinued models)? Nobody will buy them unless Toyota promotes them. I've felt like a Scion employee since the purchase of my '08 tC years ago explaining the brand to young and old alike and its relationship with Toyota (could be worse -could be Hyundai).

Let me get this straight. You're basing the sales on what you see on the road? I've sold 8 FR-S in one month, but I only see them here and there. Sometimes, I even mistake the same coloured ones as the same FR-S. Knowing I sold 8 FR-S in one month, alone, can I really say "These things must not sell. I don't see a lot of them driving around." For all I know, the owners decided to put them away for the winter. Maybe some owners got deployed. Etc.

>The point is as a common person I don't see a huge Scion presence on the road but if you want to get technical, here are the sales figures http://corporatenews.pressroom.toyot...chart.download

>Keep in mind, I have nothing against Scion (I have two of them) but my responses are more informed than some imbecile(s) here saying "I hate Scion because it's a lesser riceboy brand" (you know who you are).

xBs and tCs have been around a long time and were (still are) widely popular, so of course you'll see them often. Some people mistake the xD (and even the xA) as xBs and vice versa. The FR-S has only been around 3-3.5 years. The iA and iM JUST came out. Do you really think the whole continent will be littered with them in a matter of months?

>When the redesigned Civic '06 came out in 4th qtr '06 they were everywhere in no time. You can't expect that from Scion but talking to sales people in NY nobody is beating a path to their doors for a Scion then again gas is cheap now nobody is buying Prius -indicative of market volatility. As much as I thought the xB was fugly it's disappointing how they lost the lunchbox market to the Kia Soul -just like Honda's Insight lost to the Prius.

I'll skip the promote portion since I already addressed it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dnieves

I like Scion a lot they're a very good value (this FR-S is my second Scion) and reading about how dealerships were able to opt out of Scion/have no presence in the media/have salespeople that haven't done their homework makes me wonder about the brand (though you do seem well indoctrinated).

Scion definitely understands that they need to step up their marketing. Their massive advertising campaign on ESPN and on YouTube was actually a start from what they told me during the iM/iA training event I went to. They've also stepped up on their ability to finance first time buyers and buyers with challenged credit (5% required down that originally was 10%, rate exceptions, etc.), as well as buyers with mediocre to awesome credit get a chance at the special financing promotions without much hoop jumping.

>That worked for Hyundai -it'd be cool if they extended the warranty too (then again, that didn't do anything to help Mitsubishi's sales).

I think the bigger problem is at the dealerships level. Some don't believe or care for the product. It's already bad enough when the sales person doesn't believe in the product they're selling, but it's even worse when it's the whole dealership.

>Apathy is the worst, but to be fair I see two types of sales people. Sales people that care & believe in the product and want to provide great customer service (which pays dividends with referrals) and the lazy uninformed transient salespeople that see easy appliance cars without doing their homework until they move onto to another job. You're the type I'd recommend!!

But, the nice part about that is with the dealerships that don't believe in Scion being able to opt out, it weeds them out and helps Scion from getting negative feedback from the public. After all, the dealerships are the face of the brand.

>I wish these subpar dealerships would bite the dust (I can think of half a dozen)

I will admit that my dealership has sales people and sales managers that originally had the opinion that Scion was a failing brand and not worth the time and effort. Ever since I've stepped up to take on the Scion Ambassador role, proving them wrong, they're now starting to question their own opinions of the brand.

>From your lips........

As for the "indoctrinated" comment, is that a bad thing or good thing? I don't hide the fact that I believe in the brand and the products. Some took a bit to grow on me. But, in my line of work, if you're not enthusiastic about the product, you're not selling it. And since I'm true to my feelings and opinions, I heavily dislike showing fake emotions or opinions towards something. And although the dealership level is the face of the brand, if Scion offered me a job I can do and I know I can succeed at, I'd switch over to working directly for them. And trust me, I've been looking at their available positions often.

>indoctrinated beats not caring and ignorant, I wish you worked at my dealership aside from you I've only found one Scion salesperson I would recommend.

01-05-2016, 10:04 PM	#408
dnieves Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2013 Drives: FR-S 10 Series Location: NY Posts: 1,062 Thanks: 615 Thanked 347 Times in 251 Posts Mentioned: 4 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	I'm not sure why you compiled my two separate responses to one, so I'll separate them again. >PITA to do on a phone On the first line, you said the sales people only know Toyota and know nothing about the Scion brand cars. My response was each dealership that sells Scions have Scion Ambassadors, including myself in my dealership, who have gone to training to embody that title. The only reason a dealership that sells Scions won't have a Scion Ambassador or has a Scion Ambassador that doesn't really know anything is because the dealership was cheap enough not to send someone to training, which is going to hurt them in the end. >We need Scion Ambassadors at my local dealerships as the salesmen leave a lot to be desired. The other line was you saying Scion doesn't advertise. My response was Scion does. >I have a Motor Trend subscription (perfect demographic for a car person) -this month's ads are typical: Chevy/Acura/Lexus/Honda/Subaru/Nissan/Infiniti/Jaguar no Scion. Let me guess, print media (like television) is dead so there's no point in advertising? The last time I saw a Scion television ad (rare as unicorns) was during the Epic promotion and the FR-S uber-esque promotion. They recently advertised heavily in ESPN for the iM and iA, and their ads are still running. Since it's football season, why not? That's a great way to capture the market's attention. Does it mean everybody who will buy a Scion is going to be a sports person? Of course not, but that's a good start introducing their newest cars to the public. And did I say they're not advertising anywhere else? Or would you rather they not advertise at all, which was what you said was one of their problems? >They need to disperse their advertising dollars in an efficient way, targeting the demographics of consumers that are purchasing Honda Fit/Ford Fiesta/Toyota Yaris I think ESPN is short sighted (talk about putting all your eggs in one basket). And let's face it, a lot of people barely watch TV anymore. So much easier to just watch a stream of it on the internet at our own schedule than hope our recording device is doing its job and that we set it right. Scion also advertises heavily on YouTube. Those annoying ads before we can even watch the video we clicked for. >Are you sure the ads aren't a result of a Scion person looking for Scion related clips due to your browsing behavior? Quote: Originally Posted by dnieves I think the problem is Scion customers want a choice (like Subaru did with the Limited and Premium). If you want bare bones get the base model, if you want HID/push button start/etc get a deluxe model, if you want TRD accessories and etc order (like heated seats/mirrors) them as options (makes the dealership more money and keeps customers happy). If you want the limited buy that -> a limited edition should be like what Scion did with the tC spec series and Honda did with the Si Mugen(special color/limited edition wheels) not just raiding the parts bins of extras we want that everybody like Hyundai already has. Case in point, every FR-S should have HID (maybe the special edition can have the Corolla's LED headlights). I was thisclose to purchasing a BRZ for the bells and whistles (despite loving the FR-S's front bumper skin) luckily I liked silver ignition and went for a ten series instead. I don't necessarily disagree with your idea. I just posed an alternative to the same idea. Monospec allows people to start with a blank canvas, which is pretty much what the designer of our cars had in mind to begin with. We, the owners, get to personalize it the way we want it. The way I see it, heated seats (which my dealership can) and/or mirrors should be an option...though I think heated mirrors should be standard or an option we automatically have on the cars we get where I am. I would have also liked the push button start, dual climate control, body kit and quad exhaust to have been options, but that's where it becomes difficult for Toyota/Scion to market their special editions. Special colour and interior being the only thing making it special? I don't know... >the special color was an example, comparable to what other manufacturers do to set their limited editions apart. My argument is Scion should follow Subaru's lead in providing consumers a choice (base or deluxe) but if it hurts their bottom line then they should make desirable parts available as accessories example: under body trays, HID, muffler tips, etc as it's unfair to make their loyal consumers have to send ridiculous amounts of money for common parts outside of North America so we can piece together a car that's commonplace everywhere else. Quote: Originally Posted by dnieves Human nature.... everybody thinks they can beat the salesman. Of course. Despite the fact that we now live in the information age and anyone could easily find the invoice price, people still think buying a vehicle is still like the in the 80s and 90s where dealerships don't disclose anything and you have to play the back and forth thing for hours when dealerships such as mine are trying their best to avoid the hassle and get more to the point. >To be fair to those people, I've read many posts here in which some people have snagged some incredible deals on new BRZs (and a few FR-S owners that circumvented Pure Price by receiving extra $$ on their trade ins or accessories). Quote: Originally Posted by dnieves Others must find their lineup less than exciting as the sales prove it. In the northeast (please jump in fellow forum members) the only Scions I ever see on the road (in NY/NJ/PA) are mostly 1st gen tCs and (1& 2nd gen) xBs, I see a lot of 2nd gen tCs (not as many as 1st gen) and the occasional FR-S. Where are the iA and iMs (not to mention the discontinued models)? Nobody will buy them unless Toyota promotes them. I've felt like a Scion employee since the purchase of my '08 tC years ago explaining the brand to young and old alike and its relationship with Toyota (could be worse -could be Hyundai). Let me get this straight. You're basing the sales on what you see on the road? I've sold 8 FR-S in one month, but I only see them here and there. Sometimes, I even mistake the same coloured ones as the same FR-S. Knowing I sold 8 FR-S in one month, alone, can I really say "These things must not sell. I don't see a lot of them driving around." For all I know, the owners decided to put them away for the winter. Maybe some owners got deployed. Etc. >The point is as a common person I don't see a huge Scion presence on the road but if you want to get technical, here are the sales figures http://corporatenews.pressroom.toyot...chart.download >Keep in mind, I have nothing against Scion (I have two of them) but my responses are more informed than some imbecile(s) here saying "I hate Scion because it's a lesser riceboy brand" (you know who you are). xBs and tCs have been around a long time and were (still are) widely popular, so of course you'll see them often. Some people mistake the xD (and even the xA) as xBs and vice versa. The FR-S has only been around 3-3.5 years. The iA and iM JUST came out. Do you really think the whole continent will be littered with them in a matter of months? >When the redesigned Civic '06 came out in 4th qtr '06 they were everywhere in no time. You can't expect that from Scion but talking to sales people in NY nobody is beating a path to their doors for a Scion then again gas is cheap now nobody is buying Prius -indicative of market volatility. As much as I thought the xB was fugly it's disappointing how they lost the lunchbox market to the Kia Soul -just like Honda's Insight lost to the Prius. I'll skip the promote portion since I already addressed it. Quote: Originally Posted by dnieves I like Scion a lot they're a very good value (this FR-S is my second Scion) and reading about how dealerships were able to opt out of Scion/have no presence in the media/have salespeople that haven't done their homework makes me wonder about the brand (though you do seem well indoctrinated). Scion definitely understands that they need to step up their marketing. Their massive advertising campaign on ESPN and on YouTube was actually a start from what they told me during the iM/iA training event I went to. They've also stepped up on their ability to finance first time buyers and buyers with challenged credit (5% required down that originally was 10%, rate exceptions, etc.), as well as buyers with mediocre to awesome credit get a chance at the special financing promotions without much hoop jumping. >That worked for Hyundai -it'd be cool if they extended the warranty too (then again, that didn't do anything to help Mitsubishi's sales). I think the bigger problem is at the dealerships level. Some don't believe or care for the product. It's already bad enough when the sales person doesn't believe in the product they're selling, but it's even worse when it's the whole dealership. >Apathy is the worst, but to be fair I see two types of sales people. Sales people that care & believe in the product and want to provide great customer service (which pays dividends with referrals) and the lazy uninformed transient salespeople that see easy appliance cars without doing their homework until they move onto to another job. You're the type I'd recommend!! But, the nice part about that is with the dealerships that don't believe in Scion being able to opt out, it weeds them out and helps Scion from getting negative feedback from the public. After all, the dealerships are the face of the brand. >I wish these subpar dealerships would bite the dust (I can think of half a dozen) I will admit that my dealership has sales people and sales managers that originally had the opinion that Scion was a failing brand and not worth the time and effort. Ever since I've stepped up to take on the Scion Ambassador role, proving them wrong, they're now starting to question their own opinions of the brand. >From your lips........ As for the "indoctrinated" comment, is that a bad thing or good thing? I don't hide the fact that I believe in the brand and the products. Some took a bit to grow on me. But, in my line of work, if you're not enthusiastic about the product, you're not selling it. And since I'm true to my feelings and opinions, I heavily dislike showing fake emotions or opinions towards something. And although the dealership level is the face of the brand, if Scion offered me a job I can do and I know I can succeed at, I'd switch over to working directly for them. And trust me, I've been looking at their available positions often. >indoctrinated beats not caring and ignorant, I wish you worked at my dealership aside from you I've only found one Scion salesperson I would recommend.