..... vs. DC2 Integra Type R

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by RRnold

That's Defense by blocking his line or breaking his concentration!

TBH, even in stock trim a FWD vs RWD comparo is rhetorical...

not any more than rwd vs rwd

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by 4agze

yes its a track at night lol but thats like 7yrs ago I dont do it anymore

only thing I see wrong with a fwd is when elevation change like down hill & off camber turns a fwd will understeer but got to admire how well build a ITR, I remember back then when honda stated that they will bring the ITR here in US soil on limited number & it will be under the acura name and as i remember a lot of honda heads rolled and at the end acura Type-R was a success actually sold out half before it hit the showroom. this reminds you of anything like what going on with the scion FRS right now.

that has next to nothing to do with what wheels are driving the car. the only time a fwd will understeer where a rwd wont is under acceleration

[4agze]

Originally Posted by fatoni

that has next to nothing to do with what wheels are driving the car. the only time a fwd will understeer where a rwd wont is under acceleration

Im guessing you never been to a track before

I'll give you a video sample, horse thief mile has an infamous elevation drop listen to what KT says about the hasport EP3 civic, I driven my ae86 on this track few times and still I cant fully get hold of the left right drop.

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by 4agze

Im guessing you never been to a track before

I'll give you a video sample, horse thief mile has an infamous elevation drop listen to what KT says about the hasport EP3 civic, I driven my ae86 on this track few times and still I cant fully get hold of the left right drop.

ive been on a track before. that track even. i think you kinda proved my point by bringing up the difficulty you have with your ae86. showing a case where a fwd has touble in a particular corner does not speak to the fact that it is because of the fwd or that it is not the case in rwd cars.

[4agze]

Originally Posted by fatoni

ive been on a track before. that track even. i think you kinda proved my point by bringing up the difficulty you have with your ae86. showing a case where a fwd has touble in a particular corner does not speak to the fact that it is because of the fwd or that it is not the case in rwd cars.

No i didnt prove your Point when i say "cant get Hold Of the left and right drop" im not talking about my car was understeering or over steering its my confidence and comitment on that turn, You say "the only time a fwd will understeer where a rwd wont is under acceleration" watch the video again he was going down hill turning making a lot of understeer.

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by 4agze

No i didnt prove your Point when i say "cant get Hold Of the left and right drop" im not talking about my car was understeering or over steering its my confidence and comitment on that turn, You say "the only time a fwd will understeer where a rwd wont is under acceleration" watch the video again he was going down hill turning making a lot of understeer.

again, missing the point. im not saying a fwd car wont understeer. what im saying is that things like that will happen to rwd cars as well. the problem isnt inherent to fwd and fwd alone

[Dave-ROR]

Originally Posted by 4agze

No i didnt prove your Point when i say "cant get Hold Of the left and right drop" im not talking about my car was understeering or over steering its my confidence and comitment on that turn, You say "the only time a fwd will understeer where a rwd wont is under acceleration" watch the video again he was going down hill turning making a lot of understeer.

I've driven FWD and RWD on the street, autocross and the track. I've experienced understeer in both. He was correct but it's probably better to add the word "properly setup" in front of FWD. A FWD economy car setup for massive understeer due to engineers making the design as safe as possible for random bad drivers driving the car will understeer more than a properly setup FWD car. The same is true for a RWD car and using more throttle in any situation where you want to break the laws of physics (such as the example below) will make the problem worse in BOTH FWD and RWD. If you do get enough power in RWD to get the car to rotate after trying to break the laws of physics you'll just have all four tires sliding instead of the front two.

If you take a corner where the maximum entry speed is say 50mph in both a FWD and RWD car at 70mph in RWD or FWD, you are going to exceed the maximum traction available from the front tires, and the car will understeer.

So yes, the ONLY time a properly setup and driven FWD car will understeer where a RWD car won't is under acceleration. It's just takes a different approach to correctly setup a FWD car to eliminate the understeer (assuming the car is properly driven, as again, improperly driven cars will ALL understeer regardless of which and how many wheels are putting the power to the ground).

[NESW20]

i once witnessed a new lotus elise understeer like you wouldn't believe at my local autocross. the guy had no idea how to drive his car, so he mashed the gas and made it understeer everywhere. anything can understeer.

[4agze]

I didnt say only fwd understeer offcourse all drivetrain fwd, rwd & awd can understeer, my point was fwd are more prone to understeer on a downhill And off camber turn read my post again.

[Kostamojen]

The problem with FWD is recovering from understeer, not to mention inability to have more than X amount of usable power.

[RRnold]

Originally Posted by 4agze

yes its a track at night lol but thats like 7yrs ago I dont do it anymore

only thing I see wrong with a fwd is when elevation change like down hill & off camber turns a fwd will understeer but got to admire how well build a ITR, I remember back then when honda stated that they will bring the ITR here in US soil on limited number & it will be under the acura name and as i remember a lot of honda heads rolled and at the end acura Type-R was a success actually sold out half before it hit the showroom. this reminds you of anything like what going on with the scion FRS right now.

I could have told you that Integras suck at offroading!

I remember when I saw the '97 ITR in Championship white for 27K @ Ball Honda, I thought to myself, "that is one overpriced Integra!"

Originally Posted by fatoni

not any more than rwd vs rwd

True, too many different variables that can potentially skew the outcome; hp, weight, wheelbase etc.

[fernan2]

i wish i could drive like Keiichi.

[Dave-ROR]

Originally Posted by RRnold

I could have told you that Integras suck at offroading!

I remember when I saw the '97 ITR in Championship white for 27K @ Ball Honda, I thought to myself, "that is one overpriced Integra!"

they actually made awd integers for the Japanese market lol those parts plus some awd crv parts have been used to make an awd pikes peak ITR which was then converted to RWD.

27k with ac? Only overpriced a couple grand then. Have you ever driven one, especially a stock non fucked up one?

[RRnold]

Originally Posted by Dave-ROR

they actually made awd integers for the Japanese market lol those parts plus some awd crv parts have been used to make an awd pikes peak ITR which was then converted to RWD.

27k with ac? Only overpriced a couple grand then. Have you ever driven one, especially a stock non fucked up one?

If they made a RWD Integra, that would have been it! This one didn't have AC and marked up since it was the first year in the US. I drove my buddy's black Type R that was lightly modded before but it was around town so nothing serious.